|
Post by rdlb on Sept 11, 2014 21:05:44 GMT -6
The further I delve into all the things in the Bible, the more confused I become. Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, who does not change like shifting shadows. God is not the Author of confusion. Man's interpretations of the Bible create the confusion.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 12, 2014 3:11:39 GMT -6
The further I delve into all the things in the Bible, the more confused I become. Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, who does not change like shifting shadows. God is not the Author of confusion. Man's interpretations of the Bible create the confusion. The Bible don't need to be interpreted. For instance Psalms 91 which I read every day, they say yeah it's beautiful but......you can't take that literally. People pick over the word selecting what they like ignoring what they don't like. The Bible is God's personal letter to you. It is not written to anyone else. It is so sacred. Jesus now has spoken a love message (Bible) to you. He says, If ye abide in me. If you are a new creation, you certainly do abide in him. His words abide in you just as that lover's words would abide in your heart.
|
|
|
Post by rdlb on Sept 14, 2014 10:14:34 GMT -6
Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, who does not change like shifting shadows. God is not the Author of confusion. Man's interpretations of the Bible create the confusion. The Bible don't need to be interpreted. For instance Psalms 91 which I read every day, they say yeah it's beautiful but......you can't take that literally. People pick over the word selecting what they like ignoring what they don't like.The Bible is God's personal letter to you. It is not written to anyone else. It is so sacred.Jesus now has spoken a love message (Bible) to you. He says, If ye abide in me. If you are a new creation, you certainly do abide in him. His words abide in you just as that lover's words would abide in your heart. I do agree with your comments highlighted above and I would like to expand on them a bit. The Bible as being so Sacred in its content, can and does interpret its "self". It is not up for personal interpretation and yet does divide the thoughts and intents of one's heart personally. (God knowing the hearts and minds of men). When one picks and chooses only what they like in and from the Scriptures, they can miss out on a thorough regeneration and transformation of their life. John 3:19-21, Jesus expresses that quite plainly there and those particular words of His can be applied to any and all individuals. John 12:46 “ I have come as Light into the world, so that everyone who believes in Me will not remain in darkness." Psalms 36:9 For with You is the fountain of life; In Your light we see light. 2 Pet 1:20-21 But know this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one’s own interpretation, for no prophecy was ever made by an act of human will, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God. God pretty much well eliminated the confusion by His Holy Spirit.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2014 10:28:28 GMT -6
Let me say this, the more you read the Bible after a while God gives you a certain measure of insight. I have wore out a number of Bibles and both eyes. I don't claim to know it all because I don't but I do know what is right for me.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2014 14:08:16 GMT -6
Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, who does not change like shifting shadows. God is not the Author of confusion. Man's interpretations of the Bible create the confusion. The Bible don't need to be interpreted. For instance Psalms 91 which I read every day, they say yeah it's beautiful but......you can't take that literally. People pick over the word selecting what they like ignoring what they don't like. The Bible is God's personal letter to you. It is not written to anyone else. It is so sacred. Jesus now has spoken a love message (Bible) to you. He says, If ye abide in me. If you are a new creation, you certainly do abide in him. His words abide in you just as that lover's words would abide in your heart. No disrespect intended here, only my opinion. However, the Bible certainly does need to be interpreted . Then on the other hand you have as many interpretations as you do people who are giving their opinion.
Take Revelations for example. If you can make heads from tails about this book, my hat's off to you. The author of the book is even in dispute. Most will say John, but which John ? According to the timeline, it wasn't John the Baptist.
Most of the book is based on numerology, which is frowned upon by a lot of people saying that numerology is in the same category as fortune telling. Most say that Revelations was the recounting of a 'vision' by the author. It was written in the first person. Works that use the first person format are telling the story according to their own account.
I've had many a minister admit that they really have no clue about all the minute nuances of the book of Revelation. So, again, IMO, it does come down to personal interpretation. So, if people have differing opinions about Revelations, who knows who has the right answer, considering that there is a long line of people waiting to disprove other's opinion. Same with the AntiChrist.
When I was a kid, if the sermon was based on Revelations, I would find some reason to be excused Not only was it confusing, but it scared the wits out of me. To this very day, I find very little clear information as to the basis and contents of the book. Ask 100 people and you will get 100 different answers.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2014 8:04:15 GMT -6
The Bible don't need to be interpreted. For instance Psalms 91 which I read every day, they say yeah it's beautiful but......you can't take that literally. People pick over the word selecting what they like ignoring what they don't like. The Bible is God's personal letter to you. It is not written to anyone else. It is so sacred. Jesus now has spoken a love message (Bible) to you. He says, If ye abide in me. If you are a new creation, you certainly do abide in him. His words abide in you just as that lover's words would abide in your heart. No disrespect intended here, only my opinion. However, the Bible certainly does need to be interpreted . Then on the other hand you have as many interpretations as you do people who are giving their opinion.
Take Revelations for example. If you can make heads from tails about this book, my hat's off to you. The author of the book is even in dispute. Most will say John, but which John ? According to the timeline, it wasn't John the Baptist.
Most of the book is based on numerology, which is frowned upon by a lot of people saying that numerology is in the same category as fortune telling. Most say that Revelations was the recounting of a 'vision' by the author. It was written in the first person. Works that use the first person format are telling the story according to their own account.
I've had many a minister admit that they really have no clue about all the minute nuances of the book of Revelation. So, again, IMO, it does come down to personal interpretation. So, if people have differing opinions about Revelations, who knows who has the right answer, considering that there is a long line of people waiting to disprove other's opinion. Same with the AntiChrist.
When I was a kid, if the sermon was based on Revelations, I would find some reason to be excused Not only was it confusing, but it scared the wits out of me. To this very day, I find very little clear information as to the basis and contents of the book. Ask 100 people and you will get 100 different answers.
If you listen to someone that is interpreting the Bible for you, who taught him? Revelations was not written by John the Baptist, It was written by John the brother of James, the son of Zebedee. That is clear. The book of Revelations is a book of prophecy. I'll admitt I don't understand it either but I do read it. There are those that claim to undederstand it and the prophecies, well maybe so but I sure don't. The book of Hebrews is another story. Most attribute it to Paul but I seriously doubt it. It was most likely written by Luke and it was a sermon Paul had preached.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2014 11:38:50 GMT -6
This is from Wiki : The author names himself in the text as "John", but his precise identity remains a point of academic debate. Evidence for identifying the author as John the Apostle comes from second-century writers such as Justin Martyr, Irenaeus, Melito the bishop of Sardis, and Clement of Alexandria and the Muratorian fragment.[1] Other scholars oppose this view, [2] proposing that nothing can be known about the author except that he was a Jewish Christian prophet.[3] The bulk of traditional sources date the book to the reign of the emperor Domitian (81-96 CE), and the external and internal evidence tends to confirm this.[4] So, when you read Revelations, what do you personally, get from it ? Symbolism, and numerology seem to dominate throughout. You asked : " " If you listen to someone that is interpreting the Bible for you, who taught him " ? My answer: If it is a minister, probably a professor in theology school. Here is another example of the confusion over exactly who 'John' was, or rather, who he was not christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/17428/who-wrote-the-book-of-revelationThe task of reconstructing John's later career is complicated by the frequency with which the name of John appears in early records. There is an ancient tradition that claims that John was killed in a pot of boiling oil. But the book of Revelation places John, at about the same time, in exile on the island of Patmos. Another very trustworthy tradition speaks of John as a teacher at Ephesus, where he died around the year 100. All this indicates that there were at least two people with the same name, and that later tradition confused them. A second-century Christian writer -- Papias of Hierapolis -- affirms that there were indeed two persons by the name of John in the early church: one the apostle, and another an elder at Ephesus, who received the visions on Patmos. It is clear, from the enormous difference in their use of the Greek language, that the John of Revelation did not write the Fourth Gospel -- commonly known as the Gospel of John.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2014 17:53:24 GMT -6
The Apostle John is the author of the Book of Revelation. He wrote it when he was about 92 years old, while a prisoner of Rome on the remote desert penal colony of Patmos, an island in the Aegean Sea.
Patmos was a quarry mine for the Roman Empire, and was home to many political and religious prisoners or slaves. John, the beloved apostle of Jesus, was being held as a prisoner of Rome on this island for his incessant preaching about Jesus. Rome believed that banishing the old man John to the remote and forsaken island of Patmos, that his voice would be quieted. John was aged in years, and close to the end of his life, probably sent to Patmos in the year 95 by the Roman emperor Domitian, who was reportedly angry at the fact that John was not killed when he was dipped in boiling oil. Since John was a contemporary of Jesus, John would have been by that time, well over 90 years old - making him very likely the only apostle to survive to such an old age. The rest of Jesus apostles and disciples were martyred decades earlier. It was as if God supernaturally preserved John to bare record of The Revelation!
This is the version I personally believe.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2014 19:18:14 GMT -6
All I know about Revelations is that I don't know anything !
|
|
|
Post by rdlb on Sept 15, 2014 21:48:58 GMT -6
Well, I am not offended and do not feel disrespected by any. Many of us have found that we had to empty our full cups in order for the Spirit of God to fill our empty cups with truth. Our ideas about God and His advent as the Word made flesh required us to seek earnestly His will. I could elaborate with a number of scriptural quotes from the OT & NT. The subject of this thread "How to become a child of God" is indicative of what we need to become, a child. For most adults that will become the hardest part as they have full cups needing to be emptied.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2014 8:20:24 GMT -6
I know in here there are those that are not sure what to believe and others that claim to be atheist. I am a christian and a Bible thumping one at that. I confess I can not function with out God and his word in my life. The word is my rest, my pillow. The word gives me quietness in the midst of confusion, gives me victory in the midst of defeat. It gives me joy where desolation reigned.
My cup has been emptied. My cup now runneth over.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2014 20:27:21 GMT -6
I don't think that everyone who believes has to convince themselves that they understand everything in the Bible. As I've said before, time and time again, I don't profess to understand everything that is written in the Bible. I'm saying this because If I stated that I did , God would know that I was being less than truthful.
God gave us a brain and naturally that brain will send signals when something is not fully understood. I also do not think that questioning and trying to gain more understanding, in any way, makes one less deserving of God's love. It does not brand one as not being fully accepting of God's plan for salvation either. IMO being curious and trying to gain a better understanding is part of being human. It is a trait that God gave us. Now, what one does with that 'understanding' is quite another matter.
IMO a lot of things in the Bible are metaphors and symbolic. I get that. That is why, through the years, I have asked questions of those who have a much better understanding of the Bible than I, to 'interpret' the things that I have trouble sorting out. Now whether or not they have the right answers remain to be seen. All I can hope is that more learned Bible scholars
than I, can somehow help me along the way.
I am not hesitant to ask for help in this dept if I think it will be useful.
Still,I don't think that not fully understanding all the scriptures makes me less in the sight of God, nor does it apply to others who admit they do not have all the answers. There are scholars who have devoted their entire lives to studying the Bible, so naturally they probably have a much better understanding than I.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 19, 2014 4:36:08 GMT -6
1 corinthians 1:26 For you see your calling brethen, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called.
The Bible is largely understood with the heart and not the head.
And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven. matthew 18:3
Little children can believe in God but to a lot of very intelligent people it just don't make sense.
If you want to understand the Bible and the things of God better listen to your heart, not your head. Your head will mislead you, your heart won't.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 19, 2014 15:44:59 GMT -6
I have no problem believing in God, nor God's plan for salvation. That is a given. However, I still don't think you get what I'm saying. In order to understand certain scriptures, you have to have a working knowledge of the meaning. Applying your heart to understanding, is a good thing. Still, in order to completely understand the written word, you must first know the meaning of that word. The mind or brain is where you process written words. Once that word is clear, then you can accept it with your heart.
I've gone to some Bible classes and come away with more understanding than when I went in. Understanding is always a good thing.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 19, 2014 16:32:45 GMT -6
I have no problem believing in God, nor God's plan for salvation. That is a given. However, I still don't think you get what I'm saying. In order to understand certain scriptures, you have to have a working knowledge of the meaning. Applying your heart to understanding, is a good thing. Still, in order to completely understand the written word, you must first know the meaning of that word. The mind or brain is where you process written words. Once that word is clear, then you can accept it with your heart. I've gone to some Bible classes and come away with more understanding than when I went in. Understanding is always a good thing. Bible classes are good, there are some Bible translations that are easier to understand than the KJV also. The Bible has always been my passion, it was never a arduous task it has always been something that I have enjoyed. After I came to the Lord I tried to read everything I could about the Bible and the Bible its self. God reached down pretty low to pick me up and for that I will be eternally gratetful. I was in a mess and I deserved what I got. I have always wanted to pastor my own church. Where I'm at now I take the pastor's place if he's sick or on vacation. We have a nice church but we usually run less than 50 adults on Sunday morning. There are a few things that need to change before the church will grow and they seem unwilling to change.
|
|