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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2014 9:30:41 GMT -6
From what I understand he has already been demoted. He was a little too out spoken I guess.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2014 10:44:48 GMT -6
Just my two cents worth, but IMO, this is yet another reason why people are turned off by organized religion. I was raised Southern Baptist, ( mainstream, not the ultra conservative, whacky, Westboro type ) then went with the Presbyterians as a young adult, now identify myself as Methodist. You could call me the Charlie Crist of religion All that aside, I think organized religion has done far more damage than good. Everyone thinks their religion is THE one. We all can't be right and we all can't be wrong. God is probably shaking His head over all this infighting in His name.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2014 12:42:52 GMT -6
Hmmmm, I disagree, you sound like aspca.....(sorry). I think organized religion has done far more good then bad. It's what you make of it.
As a small child I was raised a Baptist until the tyrant decided we should be raise as Catholics. I then attended Catholic school and went to mass every Sunday. As soon as I was old enough I got away from that and never looked back. I have attended the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary. I attended the Assemblies of God and worked on receiving an ordination. I gave that up and now I attend a non denominational Church where I'm a pew warmer like everyone else.
Infighting? People all have their own opinions and they're going to disagree about things....Normal. I look for that day when things will be perfect but it won't be here.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2014 18:21:05 GMT -6
Sydney: ("Hmmmm, I disagree, you sound like aspca.....(sorry). I think organized religion has done far more good then bad. It's what you make of it." ) Oh Lord, them's fightin' words People have killed, maimed, outcast, shunned, turned parent against child and vise versa, have brought down nations, have caused people to take their own lives, I could go on forever. Religions that ostracize people because they do not believe as they do ,are not doing God's will. Look at the Spanish Inquisition, look at the Crusades, look at the Salem Witch hunts .Look at Jonestown ( although that was more about one pathological control freak than religion. ) Look at Warren Jeffs and the many many young girls he sexually violated in the name of his brand of religion. People get so caught up in their own brand of religion, they tend to overlook God's word. God is Love. If God is Love, how can the Westboro bunch hate with such venom ? How can they bring such harm and pain to their fellow man ? I'll stand by my convictions. If you don't mind my asking, what did you study at the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary ? What were your goals ? Maybe I have you confused with someone else, but I thought you said this early on : Bible Inner Meanings 1 Feb 15, 2014 at 2:09pm Quote like Post Options Post by sydney on Feb 15, 2014 at 2:09pm I am a Bible thumper, I read it every day and I know it. I have been in church and listening to the sermon and hear things that are not in the bible preached and I wonder where their getting that from. I have preached also but I have never been to a seminary, I have taken numerous Bible study courses. I've never had a OBE but after drifting away from God I had an epiphany, it turned me around. " That is what confused me. Were you speaking of yourself or quoting someone else ?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2014 22:13:50 GMT -6
Sydney: ("Hmmmm, I disagree, you sound like aspca.....(sorry). I think organized religion has done far more good then bad. It's what you make of it." ) Oh Lord, them's fightin' words People have killed, maimed, outcast, shunned, turned parent against child and vise versa, have brought down nations, have caused people to take their own lives, I could go on forever. Religions that ostracize people because they do not believe as they do ,are not doing God's will. Look at the Spanish Inquisition, look at the Crusades, look at the Salem Witch hunts .Look at Jonestown ( although that was more about one pathological control freak than religion. ) Look at Warren Jeffs and the many many young girls he sexually violated in the name of his brand of religion. People get so caught up in their own brand of religion, they tend to overlook God's word. God is Love. If God is Love, how can the Westboro bunch hate with such venom ? How can they bring such harm and pain to their fellow man ? I'll stand by my convictions. If you don't mind my asking, what did you study at the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary ? What were your goals ? Maybe I have you confused with someone else, but I thought you said this early on : Bible Inner Meanings 1 Feb 15, 2014 at 2:09pm Quote like Post Options Post by sydney on Feb 15, 2014 at 2:09pm I am a Bible thumper, I read it every day and I know it. I have been in church and listening to the sermon and hear things that are not in the bible preached and I wonder where their getting that from. I have preached also but I have never been to a seminary, I have taken numerous Bible study courses. I've never had a OBE but after drifting away from God I had an epiphany, it turned me around. " That is what confused me. Were you speaking of yourself or quoting someone else ? .......................................................................................................... One question: You point out flaws an imperfections can you see anything worth while in it? I took an online course, so actually attended might have been the wrong word. The church I went to then frowned on it and called it the Southern Baptist Theological Cemetery. I have attended a number of churches. I finally ended up in an Assembles Of God Church. This went on for a while. It was an out reach chapel. The mother church claimed they were not making enough money and were going to close it down. So the members bought it. I am on the board of directors. I read the above and that sounds more or less like something orogenicman might agree with. One thing I have learned is you must over look what others do. If you want to judge the church by them then you'll miss the mark. This is not the first time I have said this but hold onto your brain. There are usually (some) people in church are at least as bad as you'll find in any bar or dive around. There are some people in the church I go to I wouldn't give the time of day. Does that makes the church bad? NO. It's a sign that God is using that church. If they didn't have anything the Devil wouldn't waste his time. I see you have went to some trouble to imply I'm a liar Fighting words? Your beliefs and aspca's mirror one another. She should have taken time to get to know you better.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2014 11:38:39 GMT -6
Oh believe me aspca and I know each other as well as any two people can.
I never meant to imply that you were a liar, I just wondered if I had you confused with someone else about the Seminary thing.
The thing is, that Churches are composed of people, and those people are the ones who decide who is right and who is wrong. Just like when you referred to your Church calling it the 'Southern Baptist Cemetery', that shows that they ( whoever THEY ) were thought they were right and the Southern Baptists were wrong. That is a spot on definition of what I'm saying about all these different churches and demoninations.
You also said there were people in your church that you wouldn't give the time of day. That's another point. When Jesus walked the earth he ministered to all walks of life, all people. He blessed the prostitute and told her to ' Go and sin no more' He took the time, he did not judge. I guess that's my main problem with most churches. Too much judgement and not enough love
I just touched the tip of the pain that organized religion has caused people through the years.
Imagine living through the Spanish Inquisition, being put on the rack and tortured and killed in the most horrible, unthinkable ways based on rumors that you were a heretic. Or being burned at the stake in Salem because there were rumors that you were a witch. Those horrors were done in the name of religion.
You brought up Orogenicman's name. He and I may have agreed on some things, but the main difference between us is that he is an avowed atheist and I am an avowed believer. But I chose to go with the basic belief in God route instead of what a certain Church or religion tells me I must do or not do, because you can't please everyone.
Again, it was never my intention to hurt your feelings and I never called you a liar. I was just confused about the Seminary thing. Women will be ordained ministers in the Southern Baptist Church about the same time a woman is elected Pope.
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Post by rdlb on Nov 9, 2014 13:55:50 GMT -6
We were booted out of a small church group because we started a small Bible Study on another night other than a Church night. The adult Bible study had gotten so big that one individual wanted some separate teaching and some questions answered that were not being addressed at church. We were accused of trying to start our own church. Interesting accusation when one realizes Who's Church it is supposed to be. Matt 16:18
I was offered at a young age an all expenses paid seminary education in return for being the youth pastor. I refused, rather still to allow the Spirit of God to teach me. I have no regrets of leaving all of the main stream orthodoxies and other man made dogmas.
As to the origination of this post, I see no difference in the controlling of man's doctrine. Controlling and dominating others through religion and legalism does not work. I prefer a reciprocating love between God and man for therein we are made one with Him and, we learn to love our neighbor as ourselves through that love.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2014 11:25:04 GMT -6
I have visited churches that had 'cliques' that would rival any high school 'pretty people clubs'. We once visited a rather large church, walked in and found the congregation rather sparse for such a large church. We chose our seats on a pew that was totally unoccupied only to have a lady tell us that those seats were where so and so and so always sat and they would be there soon, they were running late that day, but we would have to move, ! My Mother and I just looked at each other, shocked to say the least, got up and went to another church. My Mom hurried me out before I loosened a tirade of very unladylike words right there in the sanctuary ( My Mom knew me well . I also attended an Easter Sunrise service at a church closer to home than my regular church because I was running late that day. I arrived, took my seat, sat through the entire service, got up to leave without one single person even saying 'Hello, nice to have you here' or anything of the kind. I spoke to several people and received a nod, if that. People do not realize the impact that sort of behavior reflects on their church. On the other hand, I attended a church I'd never been to before and practically everyone in the congregation sought me out when the service was over, telling me how nice it was to have me there and hoped I would consider returning. I even received several invitations to after church luncheons from strangers I'd never laid my eyes on before. It's amazing the difference between the social interactions from one church to another.
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Post by rdlb on Nov 12, 2014 21:31:56 GMT -6
I have visited churches that had 'cliques' that would rival any high school 'pretty people clubs'. We once visited a rather large church, walked in and found the congregation rather sparse for such a large church. We chose our seats on a pew that was totally unoccupied only to have a lady tell us that those seats were where so and so and so always sat and they would be there soon, they were running late that day, but we would have to move, ! My Mother and I just looked at each other, shocked to say the least, got up and went to another church. My Mom hurried me out before I loosened a tirade of very unladylike words right there in the sanctuary ( My Mom knew me well . I also attended an Easter Sunrise service at a church closer to home than my regular church because I was running late that day. I arrived, took my seat, sat through the entire service, got up to leave without one single person even saying 'Hello, nice to have you here' or anything of the kind. I spoke to several people and received a nod, if that. People do not realize the impact that sort of behavior reflects on their church. On the other hand, I attended a church I'd never been to before and practically everyone in the congregation sought me out when the service was over, telling me how nice it was to have me there and hoped I would consider returning. I even received several invitations to after church luncheons from strangers I'd never laid my eyes on before. It's amazing the difference between the social interactions from one church to another. We have had similar experiences. Seems that Churches have personalities.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 15, 2014 10:14:34 GMT -6
Oh believe me aspca and I know each other as well as any two people can. I never meant to imply that you were a liar, I just wondered if I had you confused with someone else about the Seminary thing. The thing is, that Churches are composed of people, and those people are the ones who decide who is right and who is wrong. Just like when you referred to your Church calling it the 'Southern Baptist Cemetery', that shows that they ( whoever THEY ) were thought they were right and the Southern Baptists were wrong. That is a spot on definition of what I'm saying about all these different churches and demoninations. You also said there were people in your church that you wouldn't give the time of day. That's another point. When Jesus walked the earth he ministered to all walks of life, all people. He blessed the prostitute and told her to ' Go and sin no more' He took the time, he did not judge. I guess that's my main problem with most churches. Too much judgement and not enough love I just touched the tip of the pain that organized religion has caused people through the years. Imagine living through the Spanish Inquisition, being put on the rack and tortured and killed in the most horrible, unthinkable ways based on rumors that you were a heretic. Or being burned at the stake in Salem because there were rumors that you were a witch. Those horrors were done in the name of religion. You brought up Orogenicman's name. He and I may have agreed on some things, but the main difference between us is that he is an avowed atheist and I am an avowed believer. But I chose to go with the basic belief in God route instead of what a certain Church or religion tells me I must do or not do, because you can't please everyone. Again, it was never my intention to hurt your feelings and I never called you a liar. I was just confused about the Seminary thing. Women will be ordained ministers in the Southern Baptist Church about the same time a woman is elected Pope. Sorry, I normally have relatively thick skin.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 15, 2014 10:25:07 GMT -6
I have visited churches that had 'cliques' that would rival any high school 'pretty people clubs'. We once visited a rather large church, walked in and found the congregation rather sparse for such a large church. We chose our seats on a pew that was totally unoccupied only to have a lady tell us that those seats were where so and so and so always sat and they would be there soon, they were running late that day, but we would have to move, ! My Mother and I just looked at each other, shocked to say the least, got up and went to another church. My Mom hurried me out before I loosened a tirade of very unladylike words right there in the sanctuary ( My Mom knew me well . I also attended an Easter Sunrise service at a church closer to home than my regular church because I was running late that day. I arrived, took my seat, sat through the entire service, got up to leave without one single person even saying 'Hello, nice to have you here' or anything of the kind. I spoke to several people and received a nod, if that. People do not realize the impact that sort of behavior reflects on their church. On the other hand, I attended a church I'd never been to before and practically everyone in the congregation sought me out when the service was over, telling me how nice it was to have me there and hoped I would consider returning. I even received several invitations to after church luncheons from strangers I'd never laid my eyes on before. It's amazing the difference between the social interactions from one church to another. We have had similar experiences. Seems that Churches have personalities. I couldn't tell you how many churches I've been in but the church I attend now is the only church I feel at home in. My mother was instrumental in getting the church started.
Churches have personalities....clicks might be another word for it.
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Post by rdlb on Nov 15, 2014 10:30:03 GMT -6
We have had similar experiences. Seems that Churches have personalities. I couldn't tell you how many churches I've been in but the church I attend now is the only church I feel at home in. My mother was instrumental in getting the church started.
Churches have personalities....clicks might be another word for it.
Clicks of mankind. I feel quite at home in His Church. I am glad that you have found a Church to feel at home in.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 15, 2014 17:01:07 GMT -6
Yes, I believe that churches have 'personalities'. One of my favorite services of the year is Easter Sunrise. One particular year we had planned to go to a non demoninational sunrise service. It was to be held at a large park over looking the St John's River, th largest river in the state of Florida. It is breath taking to see the sun break through the dawn over the shining river. Well, as nature often does, it rained torrents that morning. There is an Espiscopal church near the park, a Cathedral actually, one of the oldest and most beautiful in the city. Somehow magically, the clergy of three nearby Churches decided to have an ecumenical service in that beautiful cathedral and opened it's doors to the dripping wet masses. This particular church is attended by some of the more wealthy citizens of the city including the Mayor and other political notables. It was beautiful, with apparently no notice of wet feet trampling over their magnificent floors and carpet. The service was touching, with each minister and a Priest taking part. The regular members couldn't have been more welcoming. Communion was somewhat different, with the Catholics forming a line on one side to partake in their own ritual and the Protestants forming a line on the other side doing their own thing. I truly wish this would become a yearly event. It brought people together who probably would have never met on any other occasion, it also proves there are no social boundaries in God's house.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 15, 2014 17:28:44 GMT -6
We have had similar experiences. Seems that Churches have personalities. I couldn't tell you how many churches I've been in but the church I attend now is the only church I feel at home in. My mother was instrumental in getting the church started.
Churches have personalities....clicks might be another word for it.
I view 'cliques' as exclusive. All churches should be inclusive. To be a part of a 'clique' in church is not fulfilling God's will to minister to, or make welcome, ALL the people.
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Post by samsara15 on Nov 16, 2014 7:02:53 GMT -6
As a pantheist, who views the universe as sort of the body of God, and also a skeptic, with no rigidly fixed beliefs, I view myself as compatible with atheists, but also compatible with theism, a little bit of everything. I have been more or less run off of atheist sites for not being a strident enough non-believer to suit them. Bitterly attacked for even suggesting or giving even the slightest support to the idea that some sort of God might exist. Atheism is a religion, I have concluded from their performance, and non-believers are viciously attacked, so they might as well have a church themselves, since they try to enforce such strict orthodoxy.
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