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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2014 12:23:57 GMT -6
Exactly.. however had Hitler chosen to change his evil ways and repented and become a follower of God, God would have accepted his confessions and cleansed him of his sins just as with any other man or woman. That's called free will.. that's how it works. Trust me, God is everywhere, all the time . Free will is the ultimate formula. John 3:16 applies to every living human on the planet, it would have also applied to Hitler had he choosen to believe. People who believe would not have committed the crimes that Hitler did, so it comes full circle back to free will.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2014 12:49:20 GMT -6
Exactly.. however had Hitler chosen to change his evil ways and repented and become a follower of God, God would have accepted his confessions and cleansed him of his sins just as with any other man or woman. That's called free will.. that's how it works. Trust me, God is everywhere, all the time . Free will is the ultimate formula. John 3:16 applies to every living human on the planet, it would have also applied to Hitler had he choosen to believe. People who believe would not have committed the crimes that Hitler did, so it comes full circle back to free will. The trouble is we are talking about two different things. God would have forgiven Hitler had he repented no doubt about that, only then would God come to dwell in him. Until his conversion he would have been a child of the Devil.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2014 16:16:42 GMT -6
As I recall Job's children died. You're stating that it's OK that these children were sacrificed so god could win a bet? After which you turn around and lay the blame on Adam and Eve? Are you stating that god fails to take responsibility for its actions? I have read the Bible cover to cover a number of times and like you I don't understand all of what went on in the book on Job. He lost his children which couldn't have been pleasant. I just trust that some how it was worked out for everyone's good.
When we were children our mom may have said stay away from the stove while I'm cooking or don't play in the street. With a child's limited understanding it may not have sounded fair but Mom knew best. With a all powerful all knowing God our understanding is limited, that's where faith comes into play.
Speechless!
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2014 17:02:04 GMT -6
I have read the Bible cover to cover a number of times and like you I don't understand all of what went on in the book on Job. He lost his children which couldn't have been pleasant. I just trust that some how it was worked out for everyone's good.
When we were children our mom may have said stay away from the stove while I'm cooking or don't play in the street. With a child's limited understanding it may not have sounded fair but Mom knew best. With a all powerful all knowing God our understanding is limited, that's where faith comes into play.
Speechless! Understandable!
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Post by rdlb on Jan 11, 2014 18:28:08 GMT -6
God is Spirit, (some Biblical translations include the word "a" and it is often italicized). Also the book of Job is allegorical in nature and not to be taken too literally.
As to Hitler, one could guess as to what doctrinal possibilities his fate would be or not be. Interesting that Hitler's belief system could not face his own obvious defeat; so much for his free-will.
Since God is and is Spirit God would have to be infinite in God's complete nature having no beginning and no end. Much like 2 + 2 = 4 a simple mathematical equation that has no beginning and no end within time and space assuming a linear narrative. Yet we as individuals have a beginning, we are finite and have limited knowledge (gnosis) compared to the infinite Creator.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2014 4:59:31 GMT -6
God is Spirit, (some Biblical translations include the word "a" and it is often italicized). Also the book of Job is allegorical in nature and not to be taken too literally. As to Hitler, one could guess as to what doctrinal possibilities his fate would be or not be. Interesting that Hitler's belief system could not face his own obvious defeat; so much for his free-will. Since God is and is Spirit God would have to be infinite in God's complete nature having no beginning and no end. Much like 2 + 2 = 4 a simple mathematical equation that has no beginning and no end within time and space assuming a linear narrative. Yet we as individuals have a beginning, we are finite and have limited knowledge (gnosis) compared to the infinite Creator. God is not spirit, he is a spirit. Spirit to many people just means an influence or an atmosphere. God is a spirit, he is a divine personality.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2014 11:19:52 GMT -6
So far you've presented a "spirit" who made a deal with the devil, the end result of which is that people died and then you present a god who would have seated Hitler in heaven and forgiven him for millions of deaths. Who is this "spirit" and just what is this spirit's moral compass?
BTW, where is your proof that god is "a spirit?" Further, how could a spirit impregnate a virgin and give birth to itself with the intent of killing itself in order to begin a cult based on blood magic?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2014 11:43:43 GMT -6
Where is your proof that he is not a spirit? I answered this and gave my view on another board if you care to look.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2014 14:15:22 GMT -6
God is Spirit, (some Biblical translations include the word "a" and it is often italicized). Also the book of Job is allegorical in nature and not to be taken too literally. As to Hitler, one could guess as to what doctrinal possibilities his fate would be or not be. Interesting that Hitler's belief system could not face his own obvious defeat; so much for his free-will. Since God is and is Spirit God would have to be infinite in God's complete nature having no beginning and no end. Much like 2 + 2 = 4 a simple mathematical equation that has no beginning and no end within time and space assuming a linear narrative. Yet we as individuals have a beginning, we are finite and have limited knowledge (gnosis) compared to the infinite Creator. If God is spirit that would imply a polytheistic belief and I refuse to believe that.
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Post by rdlb on Jan 12, 2014 14:52:52 GMT -6
God is Spirit, (some Biblical translations include the word "a" and it is often italicized). Also the book of Job is allegorical in nature and not to be taken too literally. As to Hitler, one could guess as to what doctrinal possibilities his fate would be or not be. Interesting that Hitler's belief system could not face his own obvious defeat; so much for his free-will. Since God is and is Spirit God would have to be infinite in God's complete nature having no beginning and no end. Much like 2 + 2 = 4 a simple mathematical equation that has no beginning and no end within time and space assuming a linear narrative. Yet we as individuals have a beginning, we are finite and have limited knowledge (gnosis) compared to the infinite Creator. If God is spirit that would imply a polytheistic belief and I refuse to believe that. I think that you have misinterpreted my statement that "God is Spirit". Notice that there is no pluralities in my commentary and no references to any sort of polytheism as well. I have no problems with God is a Spirit or God is Spirit. Interesting though that the KJV Bible uses "a God" and other translations omit the "a" which is perfectly ok to do so. John 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth. KJV God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in the Spirit and in truth. NIV
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2014 18:50:36 GMT -6
If God is spirit that would imply a polytheistic belief and I refuse to believe that. I think that you have misinterpreted my statement that "God is Spirit". Notice that there is no pluralities in my commentary and no references to any sort of polytheism as well. I have no problems with God is a Spirit or God is Spirit. Interesting though that the KJV Bible uses "a God" and other translations omit the "a" which is perfectly ok to do so. John 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth. KJV God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in the Spirit and in truth. NIV Spirit to me is an influence or an atmosphere, so it couldn't be plural, right? God(s) could be plural and that would be polytheism. I read only the kjv. The niv is a fake Bible, whole verses are missing. If you want proof just ask. The niv is published by HarperCollins, The same people that publish the satanic bible. HarperCollins is owned by Rupert Murdoch and he also owns Zondervan and now has Thomas Nelson bibles. I wouldn't have any of the aforementioned bibles in my house.
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Post by rdlb on Jan 15, 2014 19:44:39 GMT -6
I think that you have misinterpreted my statement that "God is Spirit". Notice that there is no pluralities in my commentary and no references to any sort of polytheism as well. I have no problems with God is a Spirit or God is Spirit. Interesting though that the KJV Bible uses "a God" and other translations omit the "a" which is perfectly ok to do so. John 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth. KJV God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in the Spirit and in truth. NIV Spirit to me is an influence or an atmosphere, so it couldn't be plural, right? God(s) could be plural and that would be polytheism. I read only the kjv. The niv is a fake Bible, whole verses are missing. If you want proof just ask. The niv is published by HarperCollins, The same people that publish the satanic bible. HarperCollins is owned by Rupert Murdoch and he also owns Zondervan and now has Thomas Nelson bibles. I wouldn't have any of the aforementioned bibles in my house. My study Bible is a Strong's KJV. I also use the various online Bible sites which have the majority of available translations to cross check. As to the NIV being a fake Bible? www.biblegateway.com/versions/New-International-Version-NIV-Bible/ The source of the following. A good explanation of textual criticism concerning the NT can be found at this link, it is quite informative. www.skypoint.com/members/waltzmn/intro.html
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2014 20:08:57 GMT -6
My study Bible is a Strong's KJV. I also use the various online Bible sites which have the majority of available translations to cross check. As to the NIV being a fake Bible? www.biblegateway.com/versions/New-International-Version-NIV-Bible/ The source of the following. A good explanation of textual criticism concerning the NT can be found at this link, it is quite informative. www.skypoint.com/members/waltzmn/intro.htmlCheck your NIV and see if they contain these verses. Matthew 17:21~Matthew 18:11~Matthew 23:14~Mark 7:16~Mark 9:44~Mark 9:46~Mark11:26~ Mark15:28~Luke 17:36~ John 5:4~ Acts 8:37~Acts 15:34~Acts 24:7~ Acts28:29~Romans 16:24~1 John 5:7. A sample of the missing verses. Look them up, you can't there not there, because men that knew more than God did took them out. The best study Bibles I have found are the Thompson chain reference Bible and the Companion Bible by E.W. Bullinger.
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Post by rdlb on Jan 16, 2014 21:33:33 GMT -6
My study Bible is a Strong's KJV. I also use the various online Bible sites which have the majority of available translations to cross check. As to the NIV being a fake Bible? www.biblegateway.com/versions/New-International-Version-NIV-Bible/ The source of the following. A good explanation of textual criticism concerning the NT can be found at this link, it is quite informative. www.skypoint.com/members/waltzmn/intro.htmlCheck your NIV and see if they contain these verses. Matthew 17:21~Matthew 18:11~Matthew 23:14~Mark 7:16~Mark 9:44~Mark 9:46~Mark11:26~ Mark15:28~Luke 17:36~ John 5:4~ Acts 8:37~Acts 15:34~Acts 24:7~ Acts28:29~Romans 16:24~1 John 5:7. A sample of the missing verses. Look them up, you can't there not there, because men that knew more than God did took them out. The best study Bibles I have found are the Thompson chain reference Bible and the Companion Bible by E.W. Bullinger. Which I can only reply that your choices of study Bibles are fine. Not that I am a expert on what "you" should use personally; the Thompson chain reference Bible is excellent. What I find interesting with the NIV is there are footnotes to look up the missing scriptures, rather a pain to do so and yet they are there. For myself it gets back to the explanation of textual criticism concerning the NT found at the link I put in my previous reply. The NIV footnotes indicate "some manuscripts" of the which there are many manuscripts the NIV scholars used. I suspect that with the many translations printed that there are some quite biased when they were created and printed. I do prefer my Strong's as there is an exhaustive concordance in the back. The cross references are quite adequate for my uses. With that said, I sometimes quote from the NIV and also the NASV as in some instances the individuals I am teaching do struggle with the KJV. The latter I do not struggle with. I also utilize some Greek and Hebrew translations as well. www.greeknewtestament.com/index.htm www.hebrewoldtestament.com/B01C001.htm
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2014 3:58:08 GMT -6
I know it's me but I have read the kjv so much when I read another version I don't feel like I'm reading the Bible. I use Young's analytical concordance to the Bible. Smith Wigglesworth and John G. Lake are men I like to read about. Thanks for the above, I still believe the same but you make a good case.
rdlb, let me ask a stupid question, but humor me. I don't like the niv which is apparent, my question is since they have removed a number of verses, what if they had added a few verses of their own? Would that make the niv invalid as for as scripture? Just asking.
Revelation 22:19 ESV, and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God will take away his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book.
I know Saint John was talking about the book of revelations but that would apply to any book of holy scripture.
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